Having read the previous offering by impishlaugh, I felt that as a muslim I ought to respond. Fortunately though, I have had time to cool down a bit and this will not be flame: I intend to node this carefully.

There are a number of things being confused in the portrayal of people in the middle east by the writeup. Notably:

1. Islamic values and laws.
2. Saudi Customs and national laws.
3. Cultural patterns of the middle east.

When quoting from the Quran or any other Islamic reference it is perhaps wise to note the difference in authority between various sources otherwise the reader may assume that each is equally valid, and presuppose a contradiction where there is none. For example the Quran is the word of God and therefore Absolute; but Sassoon, Bukhari, and Doi are just men, and therefore not. See the difference? It is crucial to understanding the Islamic mind, which has very clear idea of what is Right and Wrong, and Good and Evil, and this doesn't change by mere social convention like it does elsewhere. The word of God is law and anyone disagreeing with it and disobeying it who calls himself a muslim is destined to hell. The other blokes are just advisors, or commentators and while some people put a lot of stock in them, most muslims don't really care for them very much and try to be good according to the Quran. It's just safer that way.

It may also be worth noting at this point that despite the highly negative image of Islam in virtually the whole media, it is by far the fastest growing religion on the planet, and most of its converts are educated western women. I have met a few and not one of them feels regretful of their change to Islam, and a few of these live now in Saudi Arabia.

A second point to make is that the Saudi Arabia is a country with its own laws and customs, many of which have little if anything to do with Islam; for example, I don't recall any chapters in the Quran on Parking Fines and how to administer them. So bearing that in mind, you mustn't start to judge Islam (the system of moral and religious rules and principles that forms a way of life that is meant to lead to Gods blessing and Paradise) from Saudi Arabia (a country that just happens to be on the Arabian peninsula). The Saudis are free to pass any laws they wish, and neither you or I have the right to question their authority in their own country; it is THEIRS, not ours. How would you like it if someone said you weren't allowed to express your rights in America? I doubt that you would be pleased, and I imagine that they are similarly displeased with people take pot shots at their way of life when they clearly don't understand it. Even I as muslim, wouldn't claim to understand Saudis though I have met many Saudi men and women, and I have to say that they all seem very pleased to be from there.

The third point is one of the middle east. The attitudes of men and women towards each other is varied across the whole world. In many places women are simply property, and they are also happy to be so because that is they way they were brought up. In the middle east, and Saudi Arabia particularly, this is not the case. The reason that this poor little country gets singled out is that people here feel some sort of outrage that someone with so alien a lifestyle can apparently do so well in the world. Saudi Arabia accepts almost none of the values of the west, and yet is richer than most European countries, and with a higher standard of living. People like to think there is a relation between their values and the success they meet in the world and it rankles to come across people who disagree with almost everything they believe and yet are happy and rich and free. And Yes I did mean to write Free.

In conclusion, are you (the people reading this node) really concerned over the welfare of people you have never met nor are ever likely to meet, or ever have a hope of understanding? Or are you just venting your spleen because you secretly want everyone to be like you or at least want to be like you, and the Saudis, and many others... DON'T.

Think about it, the answer isn't always as clear as you hoped it to be.

Updated:

I suppose baffo deserves a response as well...

1. You can never exist in their moral universe though, can you? So your points of reference are all drawn from your personal moral universe which do not correlate with theirs; otherwise you two wouldn't differ would you? I like the way you can generalize to a conception of consistency when it is clear that the issues of personal objectivity still elusive, and unresolved. 2. Muslims don't believe in human rights, we believe in justice. No revolution ever created justice or ever will, and so the idea of taking a rough guess at it, and legislating other countries in response to what you think it should be seems at best premature and at worst totalitarian/tyrannical.

Or to put it another way, hypocritical when you accuse a country of behaving that way towards its own subjects. Achieve perfect justice in your own country and I am sure the rest of the world will follow, until then they are allowed to try out their own laws until they get them right.

"Westernised enough for you?"

Not really, first point, who doesn't? It's a shallow criterion, and one that isn't unique to any culture. The same is for the second point as well, I won't even dignify them by getting more involved. The third one piques slight interest as Racism is endemic in every nation in the world, so I don't see how the "west" or anyone else can claim a monopoly over it. Though, it may be worthy of a node in itself at later date if one doesn't exist yet. The fourth? Well, it has to be said that some people are just immoral, in any society, and you cannot judge a whole people by the exceptions. If one did, then all Germans are as bad as Hitler, and should be made to suffer, all Iraqis are as bad as Saddam, and should be made to suffer, and I am responsible for a bucketful of sins that were never touched by either my intent or actions. I hope this satisfies. I am somewhat heartened by the fact that baffo didn't attack Islam, so perhaps my response did a little good. ;-)