Too convinced, hmm?

Funny you should say that considering the founding members of l0pht under the leadership of Mudge have raised outside funding rumored to exceed ten million dollars to start a security company. You may not like them, hell I think Back Orifice was pretty evil shit, but if they are unimportant, then they are at least rich, smart and unimportant.

Both the l0pht and Microsoft are the only two groups no longer allowed to post to BugTraq with updates and vulnerabilities because they give little information in their post and reference their pages instead.

It is considered bad form in the security world to drag people out to your website in the name of "disclosure", and both of those organizations are guilty of such, even if the l0pht has produced some great things, such as the l0phtCrack.