Reason and Faith

(idea) by patientfox (1.7 y) (print) ? (I like it!) 1 C! Tue Jun 13 2000 at 17:17:35

Perhaps you should consider this:

What is important to you? What is important to me?

We have different concerns and needs, and as such, different opinions on what is important in our lives. You can't just make a blanket statement like, "Most people go through life without really thinking much about things that are really important.", that's a bunch of bullshit! Did you stop to think for one second that perhaps each person's needs are different? I'm not trying to put words in your mouth, but if what you meant by your write-up, GaurdianAngel, was that alot of people are wasting their lives with materialistic concerns and not paying more attention to what really matters (aka "God" and the "great unknown"), then perhaps you should unfuck your head. What you've failed to realize at this point is that many people's very psyche is rooted in the concept of material want and instant gratifacation. Yes, this is a real shame, but what can you do about it, control their mind?

Of course, there are people who reject this lifestyle, and can say, "But is there more to it all?". There are people who will wonder about the mystery of life. Of course, there are people who are content with a scientific explanation. And by the same token, there are people who are too bovine to even considering such things, and there's people who don't even care.

The reality of the matter is, GaurdianAngel, that nobody really knows the truth about a higher power besides their own blind faith and a "gut feeling" a person may get, which you may or may not interpret as the 'God Unit' communicating with you.

I'm no religion basher, I just feel that some people don't need religion, and therefore it's no big deal to them.

As for your statement that, "One guy spends time talking about Leonardo DiCaprio who "everyone hates", according to him, the next talks about something equally useless.". Hmmmm, well. Consider this: Perhaps some things that are important to other people doesn't mean shit to you? And, by the same token, what you believe in doesn't really impact some people. Think about it.

If a person 'needs' a higher power in their life, they will seek it out, or it will come to them. You can't say that awareness of religion or the mysteries of life will be a cure-all to enrich *every* person's life. If that were true, then what about all these former christian's turned atheist? Don't get me wrong, perhaps it was in the presentation, but maybe some people just aren't satisfied with the answers that religion hands down.

And as for you cowards who dissed on GaurdianAngel with those softlinks, you can cut the stupid bullshit. This is discussion, not a "I'm a 1337 noder" contest.

(idea) by dscotese (8.9 mon) (print) ? (I like it!) Sun Nov 21 2004 at 4:26:16

Everyone has reason, but there is a choice to use it or to stick with what has been "working." This is the battle between empirical observation and mathematics.

We tend to use faith when we're not comfortable with our skill at reasoning or with the mass of facts about whatever we're considering. The kind and explicit way to say this is "I think I understand your argument, but I can't trust what I know and my powers of reasoning enough to actually behave as though you are right, so I am choosing to continue in what you might call 'the error of my ways.'" However, this approach requires a person who understands him or herself, has more humility and maturity than most of the rest of us, and who just isn't interested enough to figure it all out. I'd say extremely mature, but a little lazy.

Some people, like me, readily abandon faith when reason seems to contradict it. In many cases, this abandonment has to be reversed later because the reasoning behind it either contains some logical fallacy or some incorrect "facts." Then there are those times (Gallileo - well, he's a person, really, but think of the time he fought for his view of the heavens, for example) when we're right and we can't find any reason to deny it, except perhaps to suffer less at the hands of prideful, mistaken moral bullies. Fortunately for me, I have never suffered so much that I was forced to pretend I believed something when I actually didn't.

We tend to use reason when we think we know enough and we're confident in our reasoning skill. Both of these things can be misjudged, and the worst examples of it can generally be found in politicians. Some think they know enough to solve big problems, and they are over-confident in their ability to reason their way along the best path. This leads, for example, people like Hitler to bring about great atrocities such as he encouraged.

So you see that in my opinion, sometimes it's better to use faith and sometimes it's better to use reason, and we can make mistakes either way. The safest path is big on humility, honesty, and paying attention.

printable version
chaos

A Christian viewpoint on existentialism	Smite heathens or have a beer?	Unwillingly "Saved"	Religion does not cure stupidity, nor does atheism cure it
Faith	reason	Galileo Galilei	I know something
Alvin Plantinga	hypothesis	public piety	How to break Laissez-Faire Capitalism
Marcy Playground	Condorcet voting	honesty	Hitler
Leviathan	Mein Kampf	Keynesian economics	Socrates
moral engineering	Logical fallacy	Figure It Out	maturity

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